Nevada Backroaders

for those members who don`t know ..this is what the sign looks like

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I certainly can respect that sign. No problem there. But one of the many people who don't care about things will probably shoot it, or pull it out of the ground. Then there won't be a sign there when an unsuspecting "good" off-roader, cruises up the trail and gets ticketed for doing so. It all comes down to respect I guess. Some people have it and some don't. And the ones who don't make it bad for the ones who do...

Personally, I look at the maps that BLM have about what is open and what is closed...and I find them confusing and hard to understand at times. What I would like to see, and maybe some would agree, is a map of the trails that are open for us to use. I don't need to be confused by the ones that are closed. I won't use them so I don't need to know that they are closed. I only want to know of the ones that I'm allowed to be on. Those are the ones I would use.

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2002 Jeep Wrangler X, ARB's, 4.5" RE lift, 35" KM2's, built to crawl on rocks

I know that I don't get on here as much as I should. But those that want to get involved should join a group such as United Four Wheel Drive Associations, or Blue Ribbion Coalalition. Both groups are fighting to keep trails open. It it is only a trail that was someone going over the landscape where there was not a trail they will close. But if it is a desingnated trail both groups try to help fight to keep them open.

If interested in United Four Wheel Drive Associations please email me at jeeptrailcat5440@yahoo.com. It is important that as many as posible stay together.

Geno

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Grands can too wheel! Happy Trails
NBMC
NBCC
NBRR
UFWDA BOD,BRC

Brad, thanks for the history lesson and background on why the club was formed.

However, even in your own words, the club has been more successful than originally planned. It appears that four wheeling in the valley has grown as well. Those are both good things. Now we have the challenge of keeping them headed in a positive direction.

As an "educating club" don't you think we have a responsibility to teach the new off roader all of the aspects of our hobby? There is more to this hobby than just knowing how and where to drive your vehicle. And while we try to teach responsibility on the trail, what about the responsibilities off the trail?

To say all I want to do it play with my toy and I'm not really interested in all that political stuff is just plain BS and I would suggest that person take up golf or tennis. This hobby and others like hunting and competitive shooting exist only because of the active participation of the enthusiast not only in the sport itself, but in the preservation of it as well. To have the attitude that some one else will do that is not only wrong, it is just plain lazy.

Everyone, individual or group, needs to be a part of the process that keeps your hobby open.

I am not suggesting that the NVBR become a politically active club. I am suggesting that we become more politically aware. And I would submit that we can do so without “cramming it down some ones throat”.

UFWDA, Blue Ribbon, and Tread Lightly all offer club memberships as well as individual memberships. Is our club a member of these organizations? Does our club educate its new members as to the existence and purpose of these groups? Does our club actively promote participation in these groups?

As individuals and as a group we need to Promote, Protect, and Preserve our hobby.

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I'll keep my freedom, my guns, and my money,....You can keep "the change"

As Brad had said earlier, quite a few members belong to other organizations such as United or BRC. Iknow that he is a current member of both. I am also a member of United and former Membership director of NUFWA (Nevada United Four Wheel Association). I am also a member of other clubs that are politically active. Our own Geno is currently VP of United along with being a member of other organizations.

Brad and I, while being Club Directors, have to be very carefull on how we word our responses. We cannot overstep the Club's bylaws. While I would like to see everyone fight for what's right, I cannot tell you that you have to.

We are all adults, well big boys and girls since some of us refuse to grow up. We are able to make are own decisions. We do provide the area of the Message Board for Land Issues. So we do try to keep people informed. What people do with this info is entirely up to them.

If anyone wants more info on United or any other organization, please ask. We will try to provide any info that we can.

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"I'm not sure where the trail went, but I've got a Jeep and gas so who cares"

Rubicon Bob
Club President
Rescue Ranger
NBMC / NBCC
03 Rubi/2017 Grand Cherokee
2020 Gladiator Launch Edition

Another thing to consider is that the NVBR is not really an organization, but a "club". Clubs really have no power or much say so when it comes to dealing with political aspects, I have experience in this. Vegas Valley 4 Wheelers are more along the organization route, so they have more clout. As well as the SNTF (Southern Nevada Trail Fund) Mac and others started. If the NVBR were to follow this route, we'd likely have to pay more for membership since we'd also be paying for the club to belong to UFWDA or Blue Ribbon and be paying for legal paper work, tax filing, etc. Also there's the added responsibilities for more members to keep it all wrangled and working.

Personally, I like the way it is now. Membership is cheap, I can come and go as I please, and the runs and meetings are about fun and no business. IMO our members do a good job of making others aware of issues such as this one, and I can decide which wars I want to fight on my time with that knowledge.




AS far as the road closures, I agree with Bob, many are off shoots to nothing. There are a few I'd have to see first hand to see if they really are worth the fight, mainly the ones out in Gold Butte. Many around Coyote Springs and the area north east of Glendale are being closed likely in anticipation of new housing developments, so they want to curb any damage while they can likely. IMO it's all for nothing, as these developments are likely to not happen for quite some time still, and many of these roads are in unpopular areas.

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All Jeep trails had to first be Scouted.

1978 IH Scout II Lifted, locked, blah,blah,blah.
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee, Her car.
1992 Ford F350 XLT 4x4

So is there any reason this information cannot be posted under the Land Use topic where someone could find it without having to know who to ask for it? (or does that violate the by-laws)

It wouldn't have to be an open thread, but enough to show what other organizations are out there, what thier purpose is, and how to contact them for more information. It could also include club members that are members and/or directors (with thier persmission)

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I'll keep my freedom, my guns, and my money,....You can keep "the change"

I wouldn't mind paying a little bit more to know the club I belong to lends its support to the organizations that support our hobby.

Some members cannot afford to be members of all of those organizations as individuals. But by being a member of this club, a small part of thier dues would go to support those groups.

I look at my club dues and membership as something that I contribute for the betterment of the sport overall.

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I'll keep my freedom, my guns, and my money,....You can keep "the change"

That doesn't make any sense - Are you suggesting they are closing trails for "enviromental preservation" only to later bring in a bulldozer and build a sub-division

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I'll keep my freedom, my guns, and my money,....You can keep "the change"

the nevada backroaders has become the largest 4x4 club in the state of nevada in a short 9 years. we've gone from a core group of 10 teacher/members to close to 100 paid members and i feel this is the case because people like that way we do things. we go wheeling to cool places, we don't go out to break our stuff, we're all inclusive as far as vehicles and driver skill levels, and we don't preach.

i'm sorry kevin but i come from the school of, "if it's not broken it don't need fixing". vegas valley under the leadership of mac & george is a far more politically active club/organization and they have trouble sometimes getting their members to get involved. i think if you checked with the other major clubs in the vegas area, las vegas jeep club, las vegas land rover owners club, las vegas land cruisers, etc, you'll find the same thing, some membrs are political and some aren't. i myself am a life member of brc & ufwda and when asked by folks new to wheeling i provide them with the needed info but i don't hit them with the politics right from the get go. i teach them how to wheel safely and responsably first.

i will however put up links to the major 4x4 political organizations in the land use forum so that people won't have to "ask" someone for that info.

i know you're frustrated with all the trail closeings and other stuff that goes on and you feel everyone with a 4x4 should be standing up and preparing for a fight but some folks just want to go wheeling and the founders of the backroaders understood that. hell, mac mccarty not only started the backroaders he was also involved in the founding of white pine 4 wheelers, a politically active club, and the nevada united 4 wheelers assocciation, a totally political 4x4 organization not a club, which died from lack of interest. like bob said we're all adults and can pick and choose our own involvment in other organizations and the level of participation in those groups activitys.

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1994 jeep yj wrangler-"d.d." []lllllll[]
Retired Trail Boss and Website Director
Founder of Uncle Brad's Misguided Children
NVBROFC
Re-located from my beloved Mojave to Texas. Where did all the mountains go???

I didn't say it would make sense, it's government after all. But the housing areas have already been sold land by the BLM and are in planning, development and construction phases. So to me, it would make sense to close off any redundant trails or areas that may actually be in environmental danger around these developments long before the first home owners moved in. Whether the trails they plan to close fall within these boundaries is likely arguable. IMO from the map in the link, I think they are from my experience in those areas. BTW, many of the trails in these two areas aren't being outright closed, but being shortened to help keep them from going any farther into already existing wilderness boundaries, or so it seems to me. The main roads that actually are interesting and lead to some where are being preserved.

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All Jeep trails had to first be Scouted.

1978 IH Scout II Lifted, locked, blah,blah,blah.
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee, Her car.
1992 Ford F350 XLT 4x4

Brad,

Thank you for posting the links and for listening to my suggestions.

I understand what you are saying and agree with most of it. However, you made a good point - NVBR is one of the LARGEST clubs in NV. And our club focus is on the entry level wheeler. I think that we can promote involvement in a positive manner and do so without "preaching". As an educating club - we should be teaching the whole picture. The fact is, as offroaders we have to be aware of and part of the preservation of our hobby.

Let's look at this from a positive stand point. I hate all of the negative press. It is depressing. I'd like to approach it from the other perspecitve. Our activism can be from the positive side by promoting good realationships with the agencies (like BLM) that control the areas we play in. To a point, the club is already doing that with the addoption of the Mormon Wells trail. That is a direction I would like to see this club continue on.

There are two ways to keep our trails open - the defensive position, reacting when they anounce another closure and the offensive approach - promoting good relationships and stewardship with our local, state, and federal agencies that make the decisions and policies. I feel the later is the best approach.

The club I belonged to in Indiana took this approach. We would plan a run and meet with the state Offroad Recreation DNR Officials. They provided a whole bunch of information to us. And we found some really fun ways to help them. They helped show us how to have fun and enjoy the trails without damaging them. What to look for, and report, to prevent further damage to trails, etc. In turn, they allowed us access to restricted areas - we did a little work for them (which was fun as well) and then had the rest of the day or weekend to play. It was a good feeling to be working with the state and giving back a little bit to the land we used. It was also fun to go wheeling with the DNR folks.

Perhaps we could coordinate a run with BLM. Invite them to a run and during lunch, let them talk to us how they manage the land / trails and what we can do as users to promote a good relationship. Another suggestion is to invite a UFWADA or NFWDA to a run. We cold learn first hand from them what they do, and why, and how they are supporting us, all the while having fun playing with our toys and enjoying the trails. These groups also offer education courses - like how enjoy the trail without damaging it. Something like that could be added to a run.

One of the reasons I joined this club is to learn this area and the folks that enjoy the same hobby as I do. Part of what I want to learn is who the people are that have an impact in my hobby. I don't know the area very well yet, and I know less about the people that control them.

I understand to inorder for my children to have the opportunity to enjoy the same things I do I have to give a little back. I'm willing to do this. It is part of the dues I own the offroad community. And I know that there are a lot of ways to have fun doing it as well.

With the Boards approval and support I would to see our club try some of these things. I am willing to be a part of making this happen as well. I'll help do the work. (I know what it takes, I have been a BOD member and officer of other clubs)

I would also like to see the club support the groups that DO the work to preserve our sport. Granted, it is not feasible that we support all of them. You guys (the BOD) know which ones do the most work for us in our area, perhaps NFWDA maybe? What would be the cost to be a "club" member. Open a poll and see if the membership would be willing to kick in a couple extra $ for this membership. I certianly would.

I'll get off my soap box now and shut up. (unless you'd like me to put my money where my mouth is, then I'll keep going)

BTW, Thanks for a great club. Please don't take my suggestions as criticism, I think you are doing a great job.

Kevin

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I'll keep my freedom, my guns, and my money,....You can keep "the change"

>>> BLM has just posted the power line roads in east of Henderson
all roads off of Equestrian are now marked closed

Not unexpected. In the five years we've lived on Equestrian, we've seen the accessible areas East of the end of the street turned into a dump, as far up as any knothead can drive to dump construction and household trash. Not to mention unlicensed, unmuffled ATV's running up and down Equestrian 18-24 hours per day on weekends and holidays.

Almost impossible now to drive up there without picking up a nail in a tire.

Additionally, the Future Leaders of America like to get on the River Mountains Trails system at night and drive real fast on the paved footpaths. Henderson Cops think it's BLM's problem; BLM is largely unresponsive. Nonetheless, tax money paid for those trails.

In some cases (and Sloan Canyon isn't one) it's somewhat easier to see Their point.

Still sucks, though.

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The first rule of Intelligent Tinkering is: save all the parts!

Sloan Canyon is a perfect example where numerous groups, from hikers to ATV users to 4X4'ers pitched in numerous hours to help clean, correct and educate the bad issues at hand. And still lost.

IMO as long as the current powers that be are in at the Las Vegas BLM office, there will never be a fair and balanced outcome. Which is why I always say annex Clark County back to Arizona or California, as the government here beats to an entirely different drum than anywhere else in the state.

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All Jeep trails had to first be Scouted.

1978 IH Scout II Lifted, locked, blah,blah,blah.
2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee, Her car.
1992 Ford F350 XLT 4x4

>>> annex Clark County back to Arizona or California

Ah, that would put a SERIOUS crimp in Northern Nevada's honeypot of ducats available for Road Boondoggles around Carson City, wouldn't it?

Instead, how about if we get the Paiute tribe to annex us?

Even better, the Yavapais from down by Prescott. Those guys are smart, use the Feds to screw Yavapai County and the City of Prescott regularly, AND have a sense of humor!

As a friend of mine down there sez: "We're taking back North America one quarter at a time."

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The first rule of Intelligent Tinkering is: save all the parts!